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Listen to Payment of Legacies

This week on Hull on Estate and Succession Planning, Ian and Suzana discuss payment of legacies and other gifts that may be set out in a will.

Comments? Send us an email at hullandhull@gmail.com or leave us a message on our comment line at 206-457-1985.

Payment of Legacies - Hull on Estate and Succession Planning Podcast #109

Posted on April 22^nd, 2008 by Hull & Hull LLP

Suzana Popovic-Montag:  Hi, and welcome to Hull on Estate and Succession Planning.  You’re listening to Episode #109 of our podcast on Tuesday, April 22^nd, 2008.

Welcome to Hull on Estate and Succession Planning, a series of podcasts hosted by

Ian Hull and Suzana Popovic-Montag, that will provide information and insights into estate planning in Canada, from the offices of Hull Estate Mediation in Toronto, Ontario, Canada.  Here are Ian and Suzana.

Ian Hull: Hi Suzana.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Hi there Ian, how are you?

Ian Hull: I’m just great, thanks. How you doing today?

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Good thank you.

Ian Hull: Spring has come to our cold part of the world so all is well.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: That’s for sure, I love this time of the year.

Ian Hull: Well, we’ve got probate so before we get into our ongoing discussion about what we do next, let’s just not forget that if you’re interested in commenting, please feel free to give us a call at 206-457-1985.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Or send us an e-mail at hullandhull@gmail.com. Of course, you can also visit our blog at estatelaw.hullandhull.com as well.

Ian Hull: Now as I said, we’ve got probate and we want to sort of continue to work through the administration process. One of the – what are typically a flash point in our world when things get contentious is the payment of legacies or the lack thereof. So hoping to avoid contentiousness, let’s talk a little bit about the payment of legacies and what are legacies and what are we getting ourselves involved with.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Well at this point Ian, what we’re talking about are gifts that are actually set out in the Will.  So a legacy is a gift in the Will and presuming that there is in fact a Will as opposed to an intestacy, then you know, the estate trustee is going to turn his or her mind to preparing cheques for the amounts of those legacies to send to the beneficiaries and to consider obtaining releases or receipts from the beneficiaries as well.

Ian Hull: Okay, sorry. That’s the great thing about podcasting. Just had a drink of water and I’m dying here. Alright, so we’ve got this specific gift outlined in the Will as opposed to the residuary gift, which we’ll talk about and we’ve talked about in other podcasts where there’s sort of a global gift of whatever’s left. But we’ve got this idea, say a $10,000.00 gift, for example, could be to a charity, could be to a niece or a nephew or, someone who’s being identified with a specific amount. One of the things that – in terms of before we get into the mechanics of it, is that I worry about is the general proposition that the Courts have continued to insist on is that you’ve got to pay these legacies.  Typically the cases say you’ve got to pay these legacies within a year of the date of death. Or if it doesn’t happen then, interest is supposed to be accruing on that gift. So you want to be careful that it’s done in a timely way. And as I say, from a mechanic’s standpoint, really this kind of thing, when people know they’re expecting a specific amount, the sooner you pay them in most cases, the better. Just to sort of keep the pot from boiling over. But anyway that’s sort of a side comment to the fact that you want to prepare the letters to the beneficiaries, get the cheques ready and get the receipts organized. Now what’s the difference with a gift of a legacy and a gift of a residue in terms of what kind of release or receipt you’re entitled to?

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Well a legacy, Ian, is usually a fixed amount and so in that case, you’re looking to obtain a receipt from the beneficiary who’s going to acknowledge the fact that they’ve received that amount of money. A release, on the other hand, is normally what we look for when we send gifts of the residue to the beneficiaries. And the reason for that is because residue is typically not set out specifically in the Will, it’s going to be what’s left at the end of the day after all the legacies and all the debts of the estate have been paid and all the other liabilities of the estate. And so it’s not quantified, it’ll have to depend on what has ultimately happened during the course of the estate administration and that’s how that amount comes about.

Ian Hull: And I find that some of my clients get a bit alarmed when I say to them, when you’re giving a legacy a specific gift to an individual or to a charity, you’re actually not technically entitled to a release per se. All you’re entitled to is a receipt to show that you actually paid it. Some of my clients get a little nervous, well if I’m going to pay it, I want a release. And as I say, in technical terms, you’re not really entitled to it. But lots of times you ask for a release as well when you pay out the specific bequest.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Another thing that I remind my clients to keep in mind, Ian,  when they’re paying out these legacies is that when you’re paying out amounts on behalf of beneficiaries, our statute here in Ontario specifically says that you can pay an amount of up to $10,000.00 to a parent of a minor and if it’s an amount over $10,000.00 then steps have to be taken to obtain some form of guardianship, and we’ve talked about that in the past, over the minor’s property or alternatively a trustee can pay that money into Court.

Ian Hull: Okay great, well now that we’ve satisfied the legacies, and here again in Ontario and across Canada, of course, we are lurching toward the deadline of income tax filing. So let’s talk a little bit about income tax, filing returns at this point because it seems to be a good next step to consider.

Suzana Popovic-Montag Well what we know will typically happen in these situations is that the trustee is going to collect all the information and send it on to the accountant in order to prepare what we call the T1 Terminal Income Tax Return. And that’s the tax return that’s filed from the date of the deceased’s death to pick up all of the income and the things that have occurred during that course of time until they’ve died and that is prepared for the purposes of the estate.

Ian Hull: So what I will often do is tell the executor to get this stuff to the accountant obviously, but also make your own note or I’ll diarize it for them, to look for the Notice of Assessment with the T1 Terminal Return filing. You’re not going to always be personally involved with the actual filling out of the tax return, you’re going to get professional advice typically for that. But you – it doesn’t hurt to stay on top of the process and one of the things you want to look for is essentially the response from the tax authority as to whether or not it is an appropriate filing and, you know, sort of a benchmark is you can look to getting those Notices of Assessment approximately 6-9 months after filing.

Suzana Popovic-Montag And the reason we’re looking for that, of course, is so that as soon as we’ve got that in hand, we can request the Clearance Certificate from CRA so that we can get that comfort that, up until the day of the deceased’s death, CRA at least is saying that all the taxes have properly been paid.

Ian Hull: And we’ve had just as an administrative thing and somebody – some of you may run into this.  Over the years, CRA has been sort of a bit inconsistent on this point. There’s two points in time that you obviously need to get sort of a technical sign off from CRA. One is the Terminal Tax Return which we’ve just talked about.  And the other is the Final Return that you file once you want to close the estate off. And sometimes it is difficult to get this sort of interim Clearance Certificate from CRA. Sometimes they will require us to wait until we’ve filed the Final Return which, as I say, it’s a bit case by case, but it always, I think anyway, makes sense to ask our tax advisor to try to get your Clearance Certificate to the date of death after the Notice of Assessment has come in because if CRA agrees to issue it, that is truly a great release that you want to have in your pocket as an executor.

Suzana Popovic-Montag So Ian, maybe you can turn now to discuss – we talked about it a bit at the beginning about the payment of the actual residual bequest to the beneficiaries and one of the things that I thought we would mention and you eluded to it earlier, was the fact that, you know, typically there is what is called an executor’s year. A year’s frame of time during which the executor has to actually deal with the estate and at that time, once that year has expired, then bequests under the Will are going to start to incur interest possibly. When you’ve got an intestacy, however, you typically won’t even administer or pay out those bequests until the year has passed. And the reason for that is because there’s an expectation that you’ll be advertising for creditors and making sure that, you know, any expenses or liabilities of the estate are satisfied before you start making payments out on account of the estate.

Ian Hull:  So we talked – that’s right, because when we talk about this…I mean this is all about keeping the client happy. And when I’m an executor, I tell my clients, I say look, think of yourself as the person who is in charge of servicing the client, keeping them happy. One way you keep beneficiaries happy is that you properly file tax returns and you do what is being required as an administrator. But two is, and sometimes more importantly to the beneficiaries, is show me the money. And we talked about paying the legacies in a timely way.  Another option, of course, is to talk about when you have a Will, not when - as Suzana points out, you’re in an intestacy situation, to pay interim distributions to the residuary beneficiares. I remind my clients that where you can, it is a crucial step to take because they shouldn’t be treated more unfairly than the legacy gifts recipients if it is appropriate to get them some money now. And what you can do is sit down with your financial advisor and benchmark what makes sense on an interim basis to pay out, because you have to watch that you don’t pay too much out.

The reason for not paying too much out is, of course, you want to hold back for sort of ongoing – like anything. You’re running a business, you need to pay the accountants to finalize the return, you need to pay compensation to the executor, you need to consider other tax liabilities that may arise when you go to make your final filing application. So a sensible holdback is important, coupled with a timely payment of an interim distribution to the residuary beneficiaries if possible.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: And that really does underscore again the importance of actually retaining an accountant to help you with these steps because you’ll rely on their guidance in terms of some of the proposed numbers to pay out these interim distribution.

Ian Hull:  Okay, well I think that gives us a good summary of this portion of the administration. Because it is tax time, we will also tie into our theme and talk a little bit about some more tax issues that we want to keep in mind on the administration side. But I think it’s been interesting and thank you for your comments, Suzana.

Suzana Popovic-Montag: Thanks very much to you too, Ian, and just a quick reminder of our call-in number if anyone would like to comment on our podcast. The number there is 206- 457-1985.

Ian Hull:  Thanks again Suzana.

You’ve been listening to Hull on Estate and Succession Planning with Ian Hull and Suzana Popovic-Montag.  The podcast you have been listening to has been provided as an information service.  It is a summary of current legal issues in estates and estate planning.  It is not legal advice and you are reminded to always talk with a legal professional regarding your specific circumstances.

To listen to other Hull On podcasts, or to leave a question or comment, please visit our website at www.hullestatemediation.com.

Our theme music is UpTempo14 by Gary and is courtesy of the Podsafe Music Network.

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Listen to Karkus v. Cotroneo 2007

This week on Hull on Estates, Paul Trudelle and Diane Vieira discuss the case of Karkus v. Cotroneo 2007. The case addresses many of the issues that estate lawyers face on a daily basis, such as: proving or disproving gifts, slander of title and the importance of corroborative evidence.

Karkus v. Cotroneo 2007 - Hull on Estates Podcast #93

Posted on January 15^th, 2008 by Hull & Hull LLP

Paul Trudelle: Hi and welcome to Hull on Estates.  You’re listening to Episode 93 on Tuesday, January 15^th, 2008.

Welcome to Hull on Estates, a series of podcasts for the Canadian legal community dealing with issues and insights surrounding estate planning in Canada.   Hosted by the lawyers of Hull & Hull, the podcast will touch on some key considerations when planning estates and Wills.  Now, here are today’s hosts.

Paul Trudelle: I’m Paul Trudelle.

Diane Vieira:  I’m Diana Vieira.

Paul Trudelle:  Hi Diane.  How are you?

Diane Vieira:  I’m good.  How are you?

Paul Trudelle:  Very good.  This is our first podcast together and our first podcast of 2008, so I wish everyone a Happy New Year.  And why don’t we get into what we thought we would talk about today.

Diane Vieira:  Sure.  This is an interesting case that deals with a lot of things that we deal with in our practice.

Paul Trudelle:  Yeah, the case is Karkus and Cotroneo.  It’s a 2007 case, April 19, 2007, out of the Ontario Superior Court of Justice.  It’s a decision of the Honourable Mr. Justice Sheppard.  And I thought that it would be great to talk about this case because it deals with a number of issues that we deal with day in and day out.  It deals with issues such as gifts, proving a gift or disproving a gift, corroborative evidence required, remedies where there is a finding that there was no gift.  It talks about resulting trusts, set-offs, slander of title, costs regarding Certificates of Pending Litigation when those are resorted to early in the litigation, and also costs of the litigation.  So there’s a lot in this relatively short case…11 pages…but I thought we would spend a little time going through some of those issues.   Perhaps we can talk a bit about the background or the facts of the case.

Diane Vieira:  Oh, sure.  This is a case where the deceased died without a Will and her daughter was appointed the estate trustee.  The deceased was a business woman and near the end of her life, her business had been failing so there was a number of creditors.  And her daughter, the estate trustee, who is the plaintiff in this action, was looking through her mother’s financial records and an entry in her bank book showed a $65,000 transfer from her mother to her mother’s boyfriend, who’s the defendant in this case.

Paul Trudelle:  Right.  And I think just before we go on, I think the fact that the deceased was in some financial difficulty in her business, is an important factor that the Court relies on later on, so that’s important to note.

Diane Vieira:  Later on, the defendant admits that he received the $65,000.  His position is that this was a gift.  The daughter’s position is that this represents money that the defendant was holding on behalf of his mother.  A little more explanation to that was that the $65,000 the defendant used to purchase a property.  And then on that property, the defendant’s name is listed alone, but the property is listed as registered as being in trust.

Paul Trudelle:  That’s right.  And I think that’s important as well.  The Court deals with the resulting trust claim and looks at that factor, and we’ll talk about that briefly in a second.  So in essence the claim was by the estate for the return of the $65,000 and for a claim that the defendant held a property on a resulting trust and the estate had an interest in that property.  The Court looked at the evidence with respect to the gift and before doing that, set out the test that is required and what the estate must argue or try to establish in order to show that there was a debt or resulting trust and what the defendant needs to show in order to prove that there was in fact a gift.

Diane Vieira:  I just wanted to…another point of fact is where the $65,000 came from and when it was transferred.  The deceased had sold her house and she was moving in…she moved in with her boyfriend, who is the defendant.  And the $65,000 represents the proceeds of the estate…the proceeds of the sale of the house, excuse me.  And the money wasn’t gifted or transferred to the defendant until six or seven months later on, which is something that the Court reflected on.

Paul Trudelle:  That’s right. They looked at the fact that the parties had moved in together, the $65,000 was used to, in part, to purchase this house and make renovations that the plaintiff wanted.  The Court considered the fact that the onus is on the defendant to prove, or the recipient to prove that this was a gift, there was no presumption that would work in his favour.  And in fact, the presumptions which aren’t really referred to, would be the opposite, that there was a resulting trust or the money was owed back to the estate.  And the Court found ultimately that the defendant wasn’t successful in proving that this was a gift.  His evidence was that the money was used…was given to him to help with the purchase of the house and to pay for expenses and that was contrary to a finding of a gift.  Just another point on that - the Court refers to the evidence required in order to establish a claim by or against an estate and dealt with the issue of corroborative evidence.  Perhaps we can talk a bit about what corroborative evidence is required and what the rule is there.

Diana Vieira:  With respect to corroborative evidence, Section 13 of the Evidence Act requires that there be some corroboration of the material evidence.  And the onus is the civil litigation onus, but with corroboration.  And in this case, the judge and the Court had problems with the defendant and the plaintiff’s evidence.  He called that evidence unreliable.

Paul Trudelle:  Right.  He felt that the evidence of the parties was of questionable credibility and in the absence of any corroborative evidence, he wasn’t able to find that there was in fact a gift.  And as you mentioned, the Court referred to the burden on the defendant to prove it but said that there was also what he said was a healthy scepticism in addition to that.  Now there’s other cases that talk about whether there’s a higher burden on a party.  The burden is still the civil burden but the Courts will look at these claims with some scepticism.

So the result of the defendant’s failure to prove that it was a gift meant that money was owing to the estate.  The Court went on to deal with the issue of whether the estate had a trust claim against the defendant.  And the Court dismissed the trust claim for a number of reasons.  The first reason, or one of the reasons was that in establishing a trust, there is case law to the effect that evidence of an illegal scheme will not be received to support a resulting trust.  And the illegal scheme that the Court referred to here was the fact that the monies were transferred by the deceased to the plaintiff probably for the purpose of avoiding creditors.  And as a result, they had…the Court had a difficult time in finding that the estate could rely on the doctrine of resulting trust in these circumstances.   So how did the Court deal with the money owing to the estate then?

Diane Vieira:  The Court goes on to find that the defendant does owe money to the estate.  It’s a debt to the estate.  And he then goes on to discuss the concept of unjust enrichment.

Paul Trudelle:  Yeah, and the Court found that the money was owing to the estate and I guess the defendant had assets here.  The Court felt that it wasn’t necessary, in fact, to rely on the concept of trust or impose a trust over the property owned by the defendant.  A judgment, a monetary judgment, was sufficient.  You mentioned the unjust enrichment part of it and the Court talked a bit there about when they will find unjust enrichment in order to bring in the equitable remedy.

Diane Vieira:  Yes, the Court refers to the Supreme Court of Canada case, Peter vs. Bellow and the three steps that are needed for a finding of unjust enrichment.  And all three were here in this case.  There was an enrichment on behalf of the defendant receiving the $65,000 and a corresponding deprivation to the deceased, now the estate of the deceased, and then an absence for the reason of this enrichment.

Paul Trudelle:  Yeah, but having found all of those circumstances present, the Court still goes on to say that they won’t impose the equitable remedy of a constructive trust.  The Court refers to that Supreme Court of Canada decision and extracts a point to the effect that a monetary award would be the appropriate remedy in many cases, and that was the case here.  And the Court concludes that a monetary award is appropriate and makes an Order that the defendant pay back the $65,000 to the estate.  However, he doesn’t end there.

Diane Vieira:  No, it’s…the Court goes on to find that the estate is not entitled to that full $65,000 because the defendant did provide something in the excess of $20,000 in renovations to the house.  And if the deceased’s $65,000 was in a gift to the defendant, then the money that he contributed to the relationship was also not a gift. 

Paul Trudelle:  That’s right.  So in effect, they awarded the defendant…they made an award in favour of the defendant with respect to his Counterclaim for money that he said he spent on behalf of the plaintiff, and that reduced the recovery by the estate.  There is also the issue of a claim by the defendant for slander of title.  The defendant alleged that a Certificate of Pending Litigation put on his property was slander of title, and the Court dealt with that in very short order.

Diane Vieira:  Yes, the Court found that the plaintiffs did not…didn’t have a credible position to have had that Certificate of Pending Litigation registered.  And consequently they awarded the money that the defendant had spent on removing that Certificate, credited back to the defendant.

Paul Trudelle:  That’s right.  And finally, on the issue of costs of the action itself, the Court considered the fact that the plaintiff had some success, made recovery for the estate.  However, it didn’t establish its claim for resulting trust.  The Court also felt that the evidence of the witnesses was unreliable to a certain extent and in fact in some parts the judge said that in some parts, the evidence was fabricated.  And as a consequence of that he ordered that there be no order as to costs, and each party had to bear its own costs.

Well, I think that’s an interesting case on a number of grounds.  We’ve touched on a few of the points that the case deals with.  I recommend the case highly to anyone dealing with those types of situations where there are gifts, where you’re considering a claim for a resulting trust, an interesting counterclaim where you’re faced with a claim for the return of a gift or money advanced on the basis of benefits provided to the deceased, and also considerations for dealing with Certificates of Pending Litigation and the costs that may be involved in that.

Well thank you very much, Diane.

Diane Vieira:  Thanks Paul.

This has been Hull on Estates with the lawyers of Hull & Hull.  The podcast you have been listening to has been provided as an information service.  It is a summary of current legal issues in estates and estate planning.  It is not legal advice and you are reminded to always talk with a legal professional regarding your specific circumstances.

To listen to other podcasts, or to leave a question or comment, please visit our website at www.hullandhull.com.

Our theme music is Upper Structure by DJ AKid  and is courtesy of the Podsafe Music Network.

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In the recent case of Gubo Estate v. Cotroneo, the Court considered a claim on behalf of an estate for the recovery of funds advanced by the deceased to her boyfriend.

The deceased had sold her home and had given the proceeds of sale, being $65,000, to her boyfriend, and then moved into his home.

The Court found that there was insufficient evidence to establish that the advance was a gift. 

As to a remedy, the Court heard evidence that the advance was likely for the purpose of defeating creditors of the deceased. As such, the Court declined to apply the doctrine of resulting trusts, applying a Court of Appeal statement to the effect that "evidence of an illegal scheme will not be received to support a resulting trust."

However, the Court found that it was not necessary to rely on the doctrine of resulting trusts. The Court found that it was able to make a monetary award, and granted judgment in favour of the deceased’s estate.

In advancing a claim on behalf of an estate, the imposition of a trust is not always necessary, and a monetary award will often be the most appropriate remedy.

Have a great day,

Paul Trudelle